In this episode, titled "Think Like a Brand: Strategies for Publisher Growth and Engagement", I sat down with Greg Rollett, Head of Growth at The Grommet to unpack transformative ideas for publishers and marketers alike.

With recent changes to the google algorithm, publisher and commerce content websites need to work even harder to drive traffic volume and audience engagement. To be successful, they need to pivot their strategies and think more like the brands that they partner with and less like an old publisher.

Greg and I discuss the successful and innovative and engaging strategies he has spearheaded in his time at The Grommet. From turning email lists into powerful media assets to adopting a scrappy, brand-first mindset, this conversation is packed with actionable insights.

Whether you're navigating the challenges of organic traffic, exploring the world of commerce content, or working towards strengthening authentic connections with your audience, this episode delivers a roadmap to success.

Don’t miss these proven strategies for growth and engagement in today’s ever-changing digital landscape.

Podcast transcript

Kerry Curran, RBMA (00:01.208)

So welcome, Greg. Please introduce yourself and talk a bit about your background and expertise.

Greg Rollett (00:06.542)

Thank you so much, Kerry. This is really exciting. I know we got to spend a little bit of time together in New York. We spent some time together on some digital round tables, but were really excited to actually spend some time together and share some cool stuff. And so yeah, the Cliff Notes version, we were just talking about this, you know, pre-interview is I have a kind of a wild life. I spent 10 years on the road as a rapper in a rock band, like Linkin Park 311. So I'm going to talk really fast. If you're watching the video version, I use my hands a lot. It comes from, comes from that background.

I got out of that and got into creating media for entrepreneurs and small business owners because I love the media side. And I knew that the best way to tell stories and to get your point across and to sell products was through the media. So we, you know, we started creating videos for dentists and lawyers and small business owners and e-commerce brands. And we started doing a ton of newsletters, like print newsletters that would go in a mailbox and you put a stamp on it. And I don't look that old, but I've been sending mail for 20 years. And you know, and then obviously gotten to digital and

It's been a ton of fun and in the last five years or so I've gotten into e-commerce and just learning everything I can about what e-commerce is doing and today I get to head up the head of growth over at Grommet where we really help thousands of these small independent makers who they spent their life's work building this widget, right? Like if you're watching the video version, like this guy spent years figuring out this plastic mold for something just called cord break. 

You just put your phone cords in it at night so they don't fall off onto the floor every night and then it's right before bedtime and you're grabbing the cords on the floor like silly little things like that that make your life a little bit better. have thousands of these makers and we help them really get discovered by millions of shoppers, both on our own media property, which I know we're going to talk a little bit about, as well as millions of shoppers through our publisher and affiliate programs as well.

And so yeah, it's been a ton of fun. I've gotten to host, you know, TV shows, Emmy awards in the corner that hide out. Like I've gotten to do really, really cool stuff, but I love helping business owners to get discovered and use media to grow their business. And hopefully we get to talk about some of that fun stuff today.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (02:04.694)

Awesome. Yeah, no, excellent. So great to have you here and love your background and just how many different perspectives you're bringing to the role and to the grommet. So great. So you're talking about the grommet is to some people, it's an e-commerce site, but at the end of the day, you're really a publisher and discovery platform. So talk about the grommet in that perspective of how you identify grommets and what you're doing to build awareness.

Greg Rollett (02:35.5)

Yeah, I love that question. so it depends on who you are and how you're going to view the grommet. So to a shopper, yeah, we just looked like this big marketplace of thousands of really cool, unique products that you can't find anywhere else. Maybe you've never heard of it before, but you're so excited to get it. It's one of the best gift giving websites on the planet. And so you're looking for that cool gift for the aunt that you can never buy anything for, or your husband who you're like, nothing ever makes him happy. You'll find something cool at the grommet. But from a bigger business perspective, we really are a marketplace where we have … 

Kerry Curran, RBMA (02:59.095)

you

Greg Rollett (03:05.11)

… all of these brands who want to get discovered, all these shoppers that want to discover these great products. And then we also have our own media property with millions of shoppers that we are, you know, we have a newsletter too, we have social media, we have live shopping, we have all of this own media that we have. And then kind of the layer on top of that is we have a network of publishers who want access to these products because, you know, maybe they're running Amazon affiliate ads or, you know, they're, just doing paid promotions or brand placements.

And they want access to these products that maybe they couldn't get and with a much better payout than Amazon affiliates. So it's kind of like this four sided monster, if you will, where we have, you know, brands, have shoppers, we have our own media, and then we have publishers and they all work together because the brands don't want to be a part of grommet if there's no shoppers. The shoppers don't want to shop if they're not getting new products. Publishers need really cool new stuff from a site that they trust. And so it's just this really cool ecosystem that we're trying to build here. And it's a lot of fun because Shoppers love it, brands love it, and publishers love it. And so, yeah, it's this really cool ecosystem.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (04:08.972)

No, and it's great. I'm saying I'm a loyal shopper and have been for a while. And it's great to see the kind of resurgence that you brought to the brand. So one of the things we've been talking about is how a lot of publishers have always depended on organic SEO, Google traffic. And that's become more of a challenge. And so today, publishers really need to start thinking like brands like the grommet has already. So let's talk a bit about kind of the more traditional publishers, whether it's a Hearst or Conde Nast type of website. What are your recommendations for brands like that, publisher brands to think more like consumer brands to start engaging and driving more traffic?

Greg Rollett (04:58.136)

Yeah, so from what we see, and again, the cool thing is we get grommet articles published on a lot of these big publishers. And when they publish solely on their website, they'll post, here's a really cool gadget from the grommet, check it out. Well, within an hour, it's on the third page of their website. It's no longer on the homepage, and it just gets buried. And like you said, Google's not sending the traffic that it was. Social's not sending the same traffic that it was. And so us, we're like, hey, what happened? How do we?

And so getting them, like you said, to think more like a scrappy consumer brand is so smart for them. And whenever we get them to say, hey, can we create some custom content that is social first, that is going to be great for TikTok. And let's let that traffic run to your website where you have your affiliate links so you can get paid for that content. And so thinking social first, thinking short form, thinking, you know, how can we test out these new channels? How can we be scrappy? But the other side is

Kerry Curran, RBMA (05:24.269)

Yeah.

Greg Rollett (05:48.856)

How can we also leverage some of the content that our brands and our partners are creating and that we get to use? So here's the cool thing for these legacy publishers that I think is really a light bulb moment is they don't have to create all the content. And I think this is something like if you're a writer or a journalist or you have this journalistic thing that you're like, no, we have to write the review and it has to be in, you're like, well, this brand has 50 videos that they've already put on Instagram reels.

And three of them already have millions of views. Can we just repackage that and put our spin on it, put a watermark on it, run it out to our site and use that as traffic? Now, the brand, what do they want? They want distribution. They want to get more eyeballs on their products. They're like, well, cool, just use my stuff that I've already got. And if we're gonna be on your website and there's an affiliate link there or whatever it is. So there's this huge opportunity. I saw this with Entrepreneur Magazine. This is going back to 2017, 2018.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (06:33.921)

Thanks.

Greg Rollett (06:44.666)

I was at a conference event and I ended up at the bar sitting next to the editor of Entrepreneur and he was telling me how they wanted to get into video, but they didn't have the resources at the time. They didn't have the budget. They didn't want to hire. Well, we need camera people and we need editors and we need this and we need that. And I'm like, well, I have a show for entrepreneurs. It's on YouTube. There are five to 10 minute episodes. Put them out weekly. I'll give it to you for free if you want to put them up on your site. And it was crazy because he just goes, you would do that? And in my head, I'm thinking like,

You would do that? That's amazing. Like, and so literally overnight, my show went from three, 400 views on YouTube to tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands of views because they were putting it on their website. They were sending it out in their emails. They were reposting on social media. And so you're right. It's like this scrappy idea of how can publishers think more like brands, but also how can they leverage some of the assets that these brands are creating or partners are creating or people like the grometer creating or like, we'll hand you everything.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (07:13.912)

Right, right.

Greg Rollett (07:40.514)

So you don't have to invest in all those resources to test and be scrappy. Because I think that's one thing they think is like, well, do we have a writer who can write that? Do we have a video editor who can do this? And then, budget and timing. We're all strapped for time, resources, money, all their things. So I think if they think, how can we leverage assets that are already out there and put our brand spin on it, it'll allow them to be much quicker, scrappier, test things, and see how that stacks up with some of the business metrics of … 

Kerry Curran, RBMA (07:59.853)

Yeah.

Greg Rollett (08:05.954)

… getting more page views back to the website so they can get the programmatic advertising. How many more clicks are they getting to their affiliate links, they're generating more revenue. And let's be scrappy about it, because if it doesn't work, but we didn't invest any time into it, cool, then move on to the next one. So anyway, I know that was a lot, but that's kind of how I think about it.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (08:17.675)

Yeah. Yeah. There were so many good recommendations there. And I would add to like influencer and creator content, whether it's upper funnel, like flat fee, or again, like add the affiliate link to it. but getting that kind of promotion, getting out there talking about whether it's just the brand, the publisher brand and reminding people like you know, who aren't now browsing the magazine rack somewhere or sitting at the doctor's office reading the magazines. 

They're, you know, they've kind of lost that traffic familiarity, brand familiarity. It's getting that through influencers or creators and video content. Additionally, there's all these technologies out there like shoppable video and I love your point, getting it into a programmatic way. I think another thing too is that they look like the CPG brands, for example, for years, you know, they're not selling directly. So they have to partner with their retailer partner. And if they think about it from that perspective, are there co-op opportunities? So are you promoting the beauty brand on Glamour in a video ad, you know, getting the traffic to the Glamour site to read the review or … 

Greg Rollett (09:40.622)

you

Kerry Curran, RBMA (09:41.846)

… and I mean, YouTube videos doing that is a no brainer. It's if you've been in and you're probably not spending any time in Sephora, but I have a nine year old daughter and she wants to go to Sephora and the Sephora is filled with those pre-tweens because of the video content promoting the beauty brands. Now you can do that by promoting it to some of the beauty publisher sites.

Greg Rollett (09:58.862)

Mm-hmm. Right.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (10:07.638)

and get traffic that way. So I think you're right. There's so many things that brands, consumer brands that have had to be nimble and scrappy in the past, especially the D to C brands, it's like what worked for them, let's try that to drive traffic to the publisher to reengage. I think there's so many more things they can do with that. Then once they have the customer data, there's a lot they can do with it. So talk about what the grommet has done really well with your customer data and site visitor data.

Greg Rollett (10:46.956)

Yeah, I think one of the things that we do very well is to us, everything is about the shopper. How do we take care of the shopper? And we think that the best way to take care of the shopper is to get them into our world, keep them in our world, and then show them things that they are interested in. And so for us, everything on the grommet is now, well, you can see all the products on the grommet without ever signing in. But the big perk of, you know, creating an account on grommet is every time you upvote a product, you get a 20 % off discount that's exclusive to grommet shoppers.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (11:15.34)

Wow.

Greg Rollett (11:16.598)

And so we put that behind an opt-in, which means we collect the list. Soon as we build that list, well, now I know that Carrie upvoted this cup and she likes this coffee maker and she likes this pet toy and she's got a tween daughter because she clicked on these three makeup products. Well, now I know a lot about Carrie and with thousands of products on Grommet, I can now send her emails, I can do follow-ups, I can really create a relationship with her.  And so everything that we do at Grommet is about how we can continue to build data on a customer profile, in this case, like on Kerry's profile? 

And then how do we serve them the best way while also introducing them to new stuff? Because that's part of the grommet is you don't want to see the same cup every day in an email. You might have liked that cup, but like, what are the other things that are associated with that? Like if you've never clicked on a pet thing, you probably shouldn't get pet stuff in your feed. And so to me, this is huge. And we've run grommet, liking media property, liking newsletter that is like a personalized newsletter.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (12:11.79)

Yeah.

Greg Rollett (12:13.304)

That feels good to you. So every time you open it, you're like, ooh, new goodies from the grommet and it feels good and it's exciting and you wait for things. Another piece of it that we've tried to do really well is like having themes and sections in our newsletter that make it feel like every Thursday is a new product day. So, know, when you open Thursday's newsletter, you're getting 15 products that have never been seen before. And so people wait for that. 

They look forward to that. This is exciting. I mentioned earlier I was in the music industry and touring musician and back in our day, and I'll put Carrie in this too, CDs used to come out on Tuesdays. And I would be the person who would be at the music store Tuesday after school, seeing what the new CDs were. Did Snoop Dogg come out with a new album or the Red Hot Chili Peppers or whoever that it was? And there was this excitement of what's coming out today. And so we've created that same kind of nostalgia. And we have other days where it's like Meet the Maker, a full profile on like.

How this person's story and how they spent years perfecting this and you know, they got on Shark Tank and they did a Kickstarter and now it's out into the world, whatever the story is, right? And we've created these media properties through our newsletter that gets our base of customers really, really excited. And it's not just like, here's 10 regurgitated stories from our website, go check them out and click on them, which is what a lot of media properties do. And...

Kerry Curran, RBMA (13:30.734)

It's great.

Greg Rollett (13:34.796)

So I think there's two pieces of this. One is do everything in your power to get as many people on your own media as possible on email. We know with almost every one of our affiliates, and I mentioned this earlier with one of, you know, they put up a post on their website for one of the Grommet products and it gets no traffic. The second they put it in an email and shoot it out to their people, like, I mean, the KPIs to revenue, it's directly correlated to email. Like it's always correlated to email. And so get as many email subscribers as you can and then find a way to

Kerry Curran, RBMA (13:39.938)

Yep …

Greg Rollett (14:02.646)

Reward them and make it cool to be a subscriber and show them cool things that they're excited to open because I can promise you that no one woke up today and was like, my God, I hope I get 14 newsletters today with a whole bunch of news stories in them. I can't wait to click on them. No one woke up, but if they're like, man, holidays are coming around. I can't wait for that Grommet newsletter and see all the new products today because I need a gift for grandma or I need this or I like, now they're excited for our media, which our media, our whole business is based on selling stuff.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (14:05.518)

Thanks.

Greg Rollett (14:32.14)

Right, like our business isn't content like an entertainment story or the cool, like the new Taylor Swift review of an album. Like ours is like, here's a new cup, go buy it. Here's a new one, but we've done it in a way that gets our shoppers excited.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (14:46.284)

Yeah, I love so many things about that. And I think you're right. Thinking of the perspective of the traditional publishers that are trying to generate revenue through commerce content, which they also are becoming retailers and need to sell. And, but I love the most about kind of what everything you just talked about is how you're describing your what other brands might describe as our email list, our CRM, or our newsletter, you're describing it as a media property. And I think that is so smart because just renaming it and like almost productizing it from an internal perspective, you're demonstrating the strength and value of this content. You're recognizing that this is not just to your point of liking, we're going to send newsletters with products.

It's like really having a strategy, a content strategy and a plan and the customization tools within that. I sat through a newsletter or an email marketing seminar recently, and that was one of the biggest things they said is you're not, you're not, you need to be creating content that people want to read on the site. It's not like you're not just telling them what they, what they could already find on your site, but something new something exciting. so that in itself as a media property is so strong. Think too, you know, having that visitor to your site, even if you don't have their email address, there's so many ways to retarget them. And then we talked about whether it's a co-opt programmatic ad with the product and the publisher brand.

But or or just, you know, reminding them of great content, but there's so many ways to reengage that customer, that site visitor that again, the DTC brands are doing it. They know how to do it. How many times have you looked at a website and then five minutes later you have a social ad like it's thinking about it from that perspective as well. And I think that's such a smart strategy that you've put together there.

Greg Rollett (17:04.226)

Yeah, just two like tactical things to kind of build on that. One is, let's say you want to spend five days a week, right? Like whatever your cadence is, let's say it's five. Well, think about it like if you had a TV channel, you're a TV network. Like what are the five TV shows that your viewers must see this week? Well, that's your newsletter, right? Like, and so for us, it's like New Product Thursday, Meet the Maker Monday. Like what are the shows? Like, and so we think of our newsletters just like TV properties or TV shows or whatever it is.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (17:07.202)

Yeah.

Greg Rollett (17:33.122)

And it's just sent in newsletter forms. I think that's one. And then two, just one tactic that's working so well for some of our publishers. And we've got them to kind of institute. We've helped them to create like grommet gift guides, especially we're recording this in Q4. So it's gifting season. Everybody's got gift guides on their site. Well, one way to easily port traffic to those gift guides, cause you're probably earning either affiliate revenue or you got paid for those placements is exit pops. And it's like, Hey, before you go, would you like us to send you our top 25 gifts for the holidays handpicked by our celebrity editor or like whatever, whatever the case is. Well, now you collect the email address. You know, you get to eat and now they are basically the shop, the viewer has said, I'm giving you permission to sell me things, right? Which is, which is like the best thing in the world. So the exit pop strategy and directing people to some of these guides that you've created. Again, you've spent the money and the time creating these, these media assets. How can we redirect that traffic? And so exit pop is a great way. You know, I know everyone like clown, like, pop ups and this, but like … 

Kerry Curran, RBMA (18:17.858)

Smart.

Greg Rollett (18:31.886)

… but they really work, especially if you're trying to build a media property in an email list. And if that traffic was bouncing anyway, it's a last resort to, now, can you get 10%, 20%, 30 % of that traffic to now get into your own media? And now you have permission to sell them things.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (18:45.838)

Right, and I love that example, because you're not just saying, you know, like, give us your email address. It's like, we're going to provide value to you and in exchange, again, I love any way to capture their first party data email is so brilliant. And one of the things you just mentioned too was celebrity editors. So we talked a bit about in the startup world, the ...

There's so much around the founder's brand, the founder being like the face of the and the marketer of startups. And there's a lot of value to having a face of the company or somebody that is out there in other channels. So talk about what you've done with the grommet and creating that kind of personality to align with the grommet.

Greg Rollett (19:42.232)

So prior to going to the grommet, I was like a face of my own business, right? So I was like a founder led business and I was doing video for myself and I was, you know, I was the face of all the ads and you know, all of that stuff. Much like you are now like in your consulting business, it's the Carrie show, right? And so you want, but when you're now like inside of a larger organization … 

Kerry Curran, RBMA (19:56.674)

Here.

Greg Rollett (20:03.208)

… some of that, like there's so much red tape or there's like a wall that's put up that says, well, no, we have to just do this straight brand by the guidelines. This is how we do things. And I just don't believe in that. And I don't believe that that's the world that we are in right now and how discovery happens, how relationships happen. And so I've really pushed, know, the team at Grommet and Giddy up and some of it has been, you know, ask for forgiveness and just push stuff out and ready fire aim is like one of my favorite, one of my favorite mantras that I live by is like,

All right, we got an idea. Let's fire it out into the marketplace. It doesn't have to be perfect. And then once we get some data around it, let's aim it. And I believe that I've always believed and this is the first book I ever wrote that says that people buy from people and they buy from people that they know, like and trust. And so from day one at Grommet, I'm like, all right, I'm just going to own the person. I'm Grommet Greg. And so every email that goes out to our brands or affiliates is Greg from Grommet. Every video, it's like …

Kerry Curran, RBMA (20:43.704)

Great. Yes. Yep.

Greg Rollett (20:55.086)

… How's up guys, Greg here from Grommet and I'm going to talk to you about blah, blah, right? I'm doing, you know, short form videos for brands and for shoppers. We do a live shopping show that I host along alongside Marcy McKenna, who's, you know, comes from QVC and HSN and, but it's like, we have done a really, and we're not even great at this, but I think we've done a pretty good job at leveraging me in this role to build these relationships and have them. And is there a risk … 

Kerry Curran, RBMA (21:17.422)

Yeah.

Greg Rollett (21:20.62)

… to your employer potentially, of course there is, right? Like you could leave, could, but like while I'm here, I'm giving a hundred percent and the more, the bigger my brand gets, the more opportunities come into Grommet, the more inbound comes. And so I think this is a huge opportunity for brands, whether you're, you know, a journalist at a publication like Condi Nast, whether you're an editor, whether you're, you know, on the brand side, of course there's founder led stuff, but the more that you can like,

It's great, I share this email example all the time. It's a company called Breeze. They're a beverage company and all the emails, no email ever comes from Breeze. Every email is Corbin from Breeze or Aaron from Breeze and Nick from Breeze. And they all have different roles to play. And I love this. Like Corbin's the guy who's like, Hey, I was at my grandma's house last week and like, and you know, I opened her fridge and my God, there was Breeze in there. And like, whatever it was, it's so silly, but you're like,

I know this Corbin guy and I like him and I know about his grandma and I know about the vacations he's going on. And so like, I want to buy from Corbin or I want to buy from Nick. I want to buy from Aaron. And it really changes everything about your business when there's a human being behind your brand that you can fall in love with. And it's why, you know, magazines have done this forever with the, you know, the first page of the magazine you open it, what is it? It's a letter from the editor because you want to get, you want people to, you know, know the editor and who he is. And he talks about his, you know, adventures that month or whatever.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (22:36.6)

Right.

Greg Rollett (22:42.996)

Now in digital, it's easier not just for the editor to do it, but for everyone in the business to do it. And I think it's a mistake if you're not allowing your employees, your team, especially your senior leaders to go out there and build these brands and not just sit behind the glass door. And so I'm a big proponent of it. And I believe that you are too, like, let's get out there and build these mini media brands for our larger brands.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (23:08.236)

Yeah, and again, it's so smart. I think too, it's like, I get it, like not every founder, not every writer or editor or product review expert is going to feel comfortable being that like social space face or, you know, doing ad hoc videos. But it's so important for the publisher brand that it's like find

Find those people. All of your editors don't have to want to also have a social media personality and presence, you just need a few, to your point of the breeze example, you just need a few people out there building their brand, but promoting the publisher brand.

If there's a beauty editor or a tech editor, which I know all of the publishers, especially before the commerce, commerce content space, they have their subject matter experts help them become their own media brand. Well, you know, it can look like an influencer and creator of content. can have the links to track back. You can then, you know, reformat for paid social ads or other video ads. Like there's so much value there.

And again, I think that's another really great idea for publishers to really think more like brands to drive that traffic back to your site and drive that engagement and click through sales for the products that they're reviewing.

Greg Rollett (24:41.272)

Let me, I wanna share just one tactical thing on this, cause I think this hopefully will, so again, like let's say you're a journalist, you're an editor, well, A, you should be proud of the work that you're publishing, right? Or else you shouldn't be publishing it, right? But there's such simple things just in the promotion of your own content that you're creating, right? You're already creating articles or newsletters or videos. And so I think one of the easiest things to do is like a green screen video of, you have your article screenshotted on mobile and then you just get up and you're like,

Kerry Curran, RBMA (24:51.02)

Right, Yeah.

Greg Rollett (25:09.336)

Hey guys, I just published this new article. Here's three insights you're going to get from it. You know, swipe up or click the link to check it. Like that's content, right? And to your state is like, all right, publish a couple of those. Let's see, did one of them take off on Tik Tok or did one of them take off? Maybe now let's put some ad money into that because we're going to get more traffic back to the article. And so that's, that's something that like everyone that's creating content for one of these large publishers, that's an easy one that you could do. The second thing is if you don't like doing video, don't do video.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (25:33.966)

Yeah.

Greg Rollett (25:38.722)

You could do pretty images. You could do carousel cards. You could take a quote from your article. Twitter is still, or X is bigger than ever. If you love writing, go on X. And so there's a place for whatever format. If you don't like getting on camera, do voiceover videos. So there's so many opportunities to do this that are low effort, but high reward. So a green screen video, you could probably film it, edit it, publish it in five minutes, 10 minutes.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (25:39.224)

Right. Yeah …

Greg Rollett (26:05.654)

And so that's not a lot of time away from your daily tasks. It's not like you spend a day creating a video. So your boss is getting mad at you, but you know, screenshot, open up, you know, cap cut, do the green screen. Hey, what's up guys? This is Greg. Just published this cool, like five minutes. And I think you'll be really excited at those, at the opportunity that comes with that.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (26:24.344)

So smart. I think one other thing you just made me think about is, especially with the product reviews, commerce content, is that there's often a little bit of skepticism. Did that person, that editor or writer actually review the product and touch it and feel it? And I know, especially like Wirecutter, they pride themselves on, we're actually like touching, feeling, running in the running shoes. So just that.

In addition to your point, I'm holding the shoe that I just reviewed. Yeah, adds a little bit more authenticity and credibility. And as you said, beginning, it's trust and relationship with the brand, the publisher, the platform that is going to drive that sale. So many great ideas here. I'm excited for this. It's just so

Greg Rollett (26:55.854)

Yup, it, yeah.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (27:18.05)

There's so many recommendations that any publisher should be thinking about to drive that increased traffic and engagement and ultimately revenue driving activity. So this is great. Greg, any other last recommendations or tips for the audience?

Greg Rollett (27:35.98)

No, this has been super fun. I think, you know, one of the big things is if you got anything, if Carrie said anything like mind blowing or I did, and you implement something, just tag us on social and be like, Hey, Carrie, Greg, I love that. Thanks for thanks for the episode. I think that's the biggest thank you that both of us can get is if you're listening to this, liking the content, you've got a cool idea, share it on social and let us know about it. That's like the best. Thank you to the entire world. And obviously like to leave a review of the podcast. So Carrie's doing a great job here, you know, so

Kerry Curran, RBMA (28:01.762)

Yeah.

Greg Rollett (28:03.854)

I think those are the best ways to say thank you if you got something valuable from today.

Kerry Curran, RBMA (28:07.886)

Great, Greg, thank you so much. Again, your recommendations and ideas are super valuable and this was awesome. So thank you.

Greg Rollett (28:14.648)

Thank you, it's fun.